JUDY WOODRUFF: Good evening.
I'm Judy Woodruff.
On the "NewsHour" tonight: On the eve of a dramatic hearing, Supreme Court nominee Brett
Kavanaugh and the woman who accuses him of sexual assault prepare to testify before senators
tomorrow.
Then: President Trump meets with leaders at the U.N. to discuss nuclear weapons and Iran.
Plus: one-on-one with the president of Turkey on his country's role in the world and its
tense relations with the U.S.
And the plastics problem -- innovative efforts to reuse existing plastic and to find alternatives
for the future.
ROLAND GEYER, University of California, Santa Barbara: The only plastic that does not need
to be disposed of is plastic that was never made.
So even recycled material, you can't cycle it forever.
JUDY WOODRUFF: All that and more on tonight's "PBS NewsHour."
(BREAK)
JUDY WOODRUFF: It is the eve of a crucial United States Senate hearing on allegations
of sexual assault against Supreme Court nominee Brett Kavanaugh.
But now there is a new claim of misconduct.
Congressional correspondent Lisa Desjardins begins our coverage.
LISA DESJARDINS: The day moved fast, starting with President Trump at the United Nations
renewing his defense of his nominee and fellow Republicans.
DONALD TRUMP, President of the United States: The Republicans could not be nicer in the
way they're handling this.
They could have pushed it through two-and-a-half weeks ago, and you wouldn't be talking about
it right now, which is, frankly, what I would have preferred.
LISA DESJARDINS: At that point, the conversation was about two accusations, Christine Blasey
Ford's charge that Kavanaugh sexually assaulted her in high school, and Deborah Ramirez's
account of him exposing himself in college.
Kavanaugh has adamantly denied both.
But before noon, attorney Michael Avenatti disclosed information about a third accuser.
Julie Swetnick submitted a sworn affidavit to the Senate Judiciary Committee.
She told of attending over 10 high school parties with Kavanaugh and his friend Mark
Judge and said she witnessed Kavanaugh -- quote -- "drink excessively at many of these parties
and engage in abusive and physically aggressive behavior toward girls that included fondling
and grabbing of girls without their consent."
She said Kavanaugh and Judge also tried to drug girls drinks, so that -- quote -- "They
could be gang-raped in a side room or bedroom by a train of numerous boys.
These boys included Mark Judge and Brett Kavanaugh."
Swetnick said she was raped at one party attended by Kavanaugh and Judge, but she doesn't specifically
allege either was involved in the attack.
In a statement, Kavanaugh responded by saying -- quote -- "This is ridiculous and from the
Twilight Zone.
I don't know who it is and this never happened."
Kavanaugh's lawyer also responded and said he will not withdraw his nomination.
BETH WILKINSON, Attorney for Brett Kavanaugh: He's outraged, as you might imagine, by this
most recent allegation.
He has never met this woman.
He doesn't know Ms. Swetnick.
He didn't go to parties with her.
And we have already have -- I have received calls myself from women and men who went to
high school with him.
No one knows this woman.
No one knows -- remembers seeing her at any of the parties that they attended.
LISA DESJARDINS: President Trump fired back too, targeting Swetnick's lawyer, Avenatti,
who also represents adult film star Stormy Daniels.
She claims to have had an affair with the president.
DONALD TRUMP: If you look at this lawyer that just came out, he's a lowlife.
He represented Democrats.
It's a horrible con game.
I think the people are finding it out.
LISA DESJARDINS: The new accusation brought new chaos on Capitol Hill and new Republican
allegations of a smear campaign.
Senate Judiciary Chairman Chuck Grassley said the committee is looking into the latest allegations,
but he said tomorrow's hearing will proceed with only Kavanaugh and Blasey Ford as witnesses.
SEN.
CHARLES GRASSLEY (R), Iowa: We're doing everything to make her feel comfortable.
So she's been waiting for 10 days now to appear.
So why would we want to disadvantage her from doing what she offered to do a long time ago?
I feel like I have a definite responsibility to hold the hearing, not only for, her but
for Judge Kavanaugh.
LISA DESJARDINS: But Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer called for Republicans to halt
the proceedings.
SEN.
CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY), Minority Leader: I strongly believe Judge Kavanaugh should withdraw from
consideration and the president should withdraw this nomination if Kavanaugh or won't do it
voluntarily.
If he will not, at the very least, the hearing and vote should be postponed while the FBI
®MDNM¯investigates all of these very serious and very troubling allegations.
LISA DESJARDINS: Some Senate Republicans, including Jeff Flake of Arizona, are voicing
doubts about proceeding.
SEN.
JEFF FLAKE (R), Arizona: However this vote goes, I'm confident in saying that it will
forever be steeped in doubt.
This doubt is the only thing of which I am confident about this process.
LISA DESJARDINS: But South Carolina Republican Lindsey Graham raised sharp doubts about the
latest accuser.
SEN.
LINDSEY GRAHAM (R), South Carolina: This is getting into the Twilight Zone.
You're talking about Brett Kavanaugh being a serial rapist during high school as a sophomore
in high school.
I have a hard time believing you did it then and you have never done it before.
I do believe it's so important to invite Mr. Avenatti's client to come to the committee
and being interviewed by staff.
That should happen right now.
LISA DESJARDINS: Grassley has scheduled a committee vote on Kavanaugh's nomination for
Friday.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And Lisa joins me now here in our studio.
And I want to say, just within the last hour, a lot of fast-moving pieces here.
The president continues to hold sway at a news conference in New York so at those U.N.
meetings.
This news conferences is now into its second hour.
We can tell you that, not long ago, he was asked, of course, about these allegations
by these women against Judge Kavanaugh.
And he said at first that these are all false allegations, but then he went on to say that
he wants to hear from the women.
Here's part of what he said:
DONALD TRUMP: The Republican senators have delayed this for weeks now.
They're giving the women a major chance to speak.
Now, it's possible I will hear that and I will say, hey, I'm changing my mind.
That is possible.
We want to give them a chance to speak.
And they're given...
QUESTION: Do you think all three should have a chance?
All three should have a chance to...
(CROSSTALK)
DONALD TRUMP: Well, whoever is given a chance.
We have delayed it a long time, but they're going to have a big shot at speaking and making
their case.
And you know what?
I could be persuaded also.
JUDY WOODRUFF: So President Trump also acknowledged, Lisa, that he has a particular perspective
on all this, because he said, he acknowledged that he himself has been falsely accused of
sexual misconduct.
Here's how he commented on that:
DONALD TRUMP: I have had a lot of false charges made against me.
I'm a very famous person, unfortunately.
I have been a famous person for a long time, but I have had a lot of false charges made
against me, really false charges.
I know friends that have had false charges.
People want fame.
They want money.
They want whatever.
So when I see it, I view it differently than somebody sitting home watching television,
where they say, oh, Judge Kavanaugh, this or that.
It's happened to me many times.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Now, the president, Lisa, and other Republicans we have been hearing are
pretty dismissive of these newest set of allegations from the woman Julie Swetnick.
But these are serious allegations.
What do we know about them?
LISA DESJARDINS: These are incredibly serious allegations.
We covered some of them in our report at the beginning of the story.
But she is saying not just about the role of Mark Judge and Mr. Kavanaugh, what she
is accusing them of.
She is saying she witnessed parties where there were lines of men waiting outside bedroom
doors to molest a woman who she understood to be inside.
So, incredibly serious allegations.
Right now, the committee says it is looking to speak to her, which is a process they have
used before with the other accusers in this case.
There will be no FBI investigations, say Republicans, not at this point.
Democrats, of course, would like Ms. Swetnick to appear in a hearing, which she and her
attorney have said she is willing to do.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And what are -- I mentioned that some Republicans, the president being
very dismissive of what she's saying.
What are Republicans and Democrats saying about this?
LISA DESJARDINS: Right.
The president seemed to go back and forth.
He said he doesn't know a lot about these accusations yet, but he did at one point also
say he thought they were false.
So, there were kind of conflicting statements from him.
We have seen just in the last couple of hours a new letter from supporters of Mr. Kavanaugh,
high school friends of his, 60 of them, men and women, who say that they do not recall
anything like what we heard Ms. Swetnick describing.
Now, it's notable that all of the women who signed this letter are the same women who
signed a letter over a week ago supporting Mr. Kavanaugh, except for two, who are new
to this letter.
Republicans, Judy, are questioning the timing of this accusation, both because of the hearing.
And also they question how old Ms. Swetnick was at the time.
They're also going farther, though.
They're questioning a little bit of her character and saying, if these things happened to you,
if you witnessed these parties, why did you continue to go to these parties?
Democrats, on the other hand, say this is part of mounting evidence of a culture that
they believe that Brett Kavanaugh was a part of.
Now, what she has -- what Ms. Swetnick talked about also matches an account in The New Yorker
this weekend by a former ex-girlfriend of his friend Mark Judge.
This ex-girlfriend said that Judge confided in her that he did in fact get inebriated
and have sexual experiences with women who may not have been fully conscious at the time.
That's her claim.
But this is what Democrats are pointing to, as they see some mounting evidence.
It's obviously part of a very large debate.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And my understanding is that she's reconfirmed that statement today.
LISA DESJARDINS: That's right.
And she -- that ex-girlfriend says she's willing to testify as well.
JUDY WOODRUFF: So to get back to the original reason for this hearing, Christine Blasey
Ford, what do we know, Lisa, at this point about how this hearing is going to unfold?
LISA DESJARDINS: Right.
This is more what we know, the finite universe for tomorrow.
Let's talk about the hearing first.
We expect about two hours for each witness.
It will be about five minutes per senator.
But the Republican senators are expected to pull that time and yield it all to prosecutor
Rachel Mitchell.
She is a prosecutor from Maricopa County, over 20 years experience, much of it...
JUDY WOODRUFF: Arizona.
LISA DESJARDINS: In Maricopa County, Arizona, exactly, Phoenix.
And much of that has been in sex crimes.
Now, notable, Judy, this is going to be a much smaller hearing room than we have seen
before.
For example, the number of seats for the press are a quarter of what they were with the first
Kavanaugh hearing.
I suspect the seats for the public and therefore potential protesters also will be smaller.
But it's going to be a shorter and smaller hearing that Republicans have designed.
JUDY WOODRUFF: So, Lisa, what do we know from -- there is some polling that has been done
about the public and how the American people are viewing, are undertaking in all this.
What do we see there?
LISA DESJARDINS: Well, I think it's no surprise, like on almost every controversial issue these
days, Americans are divided.
There is a plurality who generally oppose Judge Kavanaugh's nomination right now, 43
percent -- 38 percent say they're in favor of it in general.
But we found there were more interesting sort of highlights when you drill down.
The party divide here is vast.
Not a shock.
But when we asked if the charge by Christine Blasey Ford is true, should Judge Kavanaugh
be confirmed, and that's if it's true, Democrats, 12 percent said yes, he should be confirmed.
But over half a Republican said, if that charge is true, that he should be confirmed.
So, right now, there's two debates.
One, are these accusations true?
And then there's a debate we really haven't talked about much, which, if they are true,
what does the American public think should happen?
All of that right now is lost in a kind of chaotic political situation.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And, of course, the whole question of whether we will be able to get to truth
tomorrow, because many people are saying what we're going to come away with are impressions,
and not knowing, because we don't have final evidence -- we don't have evidence that dates
back to 1982.
LISA DESJARDINS: That's right.
And there's a real challenge for Democratic senators.
There are 10 on this committee.
If you're a Democratic senator, and you have five minutes to question Judge Kavanaugh,
a lot of these senators -- I'm not joking -- it takes them three minutes to get out
a question.
So their questions must be short.
And then Judge Kavanaugh also could have longer answers.
It's going to be very difficult to have questions and follow-up in this setting.
JUDY WOODRUFF: While the Republicans will be presumably more focused, because the prosecutor
-- this practiced prosecutor in Rachel Mitchell is going to be asking all of their questions.
LISA DESJARDINS: Right.
That's right.
She pools all of her time.
She can have a direct line of questioning throughout her entire timing vs. each senator
may have different lines of questions that they want to ask.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Well, we are going to be covering every moment of it.
And you're going to be there for us.
LISA DESJARDINS: I'm getting there early.
JUDY WOODRUFF: You're going to be there early.
Lisa Desjardins, thank you.
LISA DESJARDINS: You're welcome.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And you are going to want to know what to expect from the Senate Judiciary
Committee tomorrow in the questioning of Judge Kavanaugh and Professor Blasey Ford.
For that now, I'm joined by Julie Goldscheid.
She is a professor of law at the City University of New York, where she teaches classes on
gender and law.
She is one of several law professors who wrote a letter today urging the Judiciary Committee
to further investigate the claims made by Blasey Ford and these other women.
Professor Goldscheid, let me just start by asking, the letter to the committee, what
was the point you were making in that letter, which is critical of how the committee is
structured tomorrow?
JULIE GOLDSCHEID, Professor of Law, CUNY School of Law: Yes, thank you.
The point of the letter is really to ask the senators to do what we would expect any fact-finder
to do, which is to pause, to get a full investigation, and to assess all of the evidence in the context
that's before the committee.
This is not a criminal case.
It's not a civil case.
It's not about evidence that's going to be assessed based on a preponderance of the evidence
or beyond a reasonable doubt standard.
This is a question about whether or not somebody should be nominated and appointed to the Supreme
Court, the highest court in the country.
And for that, there are many complex questions that I would think the senators should be
interested in.
They should be interested in assessing the very serious allegations that have been made
and hearing the nominees reflections on those allegations.
Not only do they raise very serious concerns, but they also raise complex questions that
are of the type of issue -- that reflect the type of issues that the court deals with all
the time.
And the senators should be interested in how the nominee reflects on that kind of complicated
allegation and complicated dynamic.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And I know that you and the others who were signing this letter were calling
for an investigation to take place, just as Dr. Blasey Ford and her attorney were calling
for.
But we know that there will be, there has been no, and won't be an FBI investigation.
They have been talking to her.
What will be missing then?
I mean, what is it -- what is it -- what will be the role of Rachel Mitchell, who will be
asking question for the Republicans, and then of the Democratic senators in getting to the
bottom of this, as best they can, when there has not been an FBI investigation?
JULIE GOLDSCHEID: Right.
Well, your point is a very good one.
Without a full investigation for background, and without all the witnesses who can speak
to the allegations, there's really an incomplete picture that will be painted at the hearings,
by definition, unless the senators decide to open up the hearings to more witnesses
who can talk about their -- the accounts that they heard about the allegations before the
-- before these hearings.
So, the task for the -- for the hearings tomorrow is to paint as clear and as complete and as
neutral a picture as possible about what Dr. Ford experienced and what the nominee, Judge
Kavanaugh, experienced, and to hear his reflections on these very delicate details and difficult
allegations.
JUDY WOODRUFF: So, we have been -- her opening statement, Christine Blasey Ford's opening
statement, has been released, we know.
We have been able to take a look at that.
She's pretty much giving the same description of what happened that night at that party
in 1982 in that summer that we have been told, with a little more detail.
Given that, and given that Judge Kavanaugh is saying he wasn't at the party, doesn't
know her, how does any -- how does a questioner get to some evidence, some information that's
going to advance our understanding of what really happened?
JULIE GOLDSCHEID: Yes.
Well, one thing that the questioner can do is can ask about both witnesses' understandings
of some of the other information that has come to come to light.
So, for example, if Judge Kavanaugh says he has no recollection, he can be probed about
some of the other accounts that have come forward about the details of some of the parties
and the atmosphere and the culture that at least many people think took place at that
school at the time that he was there.
So, she can get his reactions to those -- those accounts of what was going on at the time.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Are questions about how much drinking did he do, how much partying, I mean,
are those kinds of general questions going to bring us closer to understanding whether
this happened or not?
JULIE GOLDSCHEID: I think part of the task is to come to as clear an assessment of what
happened as possible.
And we know that, in many cases like this, there are competing versions, competing accounts
of what happened.
So, the task for the senators is really to listen very carefully and closely to the answers
to try to hear how much consistency or inconsistency there is in the respective witnesses' reports
and to make their own assessments, both about what happened, but about how the nominee's
responses bear on his ability to serve as a Supreme Court justice, because I really
can't underscore enough that that's what's at issue here.
This is more akin to a job interview than any kind of criminal or civil proceeding.
It's really about his qualifications for this very, very important position.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Professor Goldscheid, finally, just one question.
If you were asking questions of Judge Kavanaugh tomorrow, what's the most important thing
you would want to know from him?
JULIE GOLDSCHEID: Yes, good question.
I might want to know his view, if the allegations were true, what he -- what his views would
be about them and what he would think about them.
I really want to hear his thoughts about the seriousness of sexual assault.
We know that sexual assault is pervasive.
It continues to be pervasive, despite all of the gains and progress that's been made,
and I want to hear what his assessment is of those accounts.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Julie Goldscheid, she's a professor at the City University of New York.
We thank you.
JULIE GOLDSCHEID: Thank you.
CUNY School of Law.
Thank you.
JUDY WOODRUFF: I'm sorry.
Thank you very much.
And a reminder: We will have full live coverage of the Senate Judiciary Committee hearing
with Brett Kavanaugh and Christine Blasey Ford tomorrow.
That is starting at 10:00 a.m.
Eastern.
You can check your local PBS station listings for more information, or you can watch us
livestreaming.
That's online at PBS.org/NewsHour.
Back now to President Trump's day at the United Nations, where the focus was heavily on Iran.
Our foreign affairs correspondent, Nick Schifrin, reports.
NICK SCHIFRIN: One day after declaring disdain for global governance, President Trump walked
into the U.N. Security Council, and the world's top diplomats hushed their voices.
But in a room defined by decorum, a president who doesn't always stick to the script showed
respect to tradition and stuck to the script.
DONALD TRUMP, President of the United States: The Security Council is called to order.
NICK SCHIFRIN: This was Mr. Trump's first Security Council briefing, and he immediately
targeted Iran.
DONALD TRUMP: The United States will pursue additional sanctions, tougher than ever before,
to counter the entire range of Iran's malign conduct.
Any individual or entity who fails to comply with these sanctions will face severe consequences.
NICK SCHIFRIN: The U.S. is trying to pressure Iran to curve its ballistic missile program
and regional proxies, such as Hezbollah, that attack Iran's enemies.
To do so, the U.S. is pressuring Europeans for help.
But the European Union's top diplomat this week announced new ways for Iran to avoid
U.S. sanctions, and European leaders are criticizing the president's decision to withdraw from
the Iran nuclear deal they negotiated together, known as the JCPOA, then reimpose sanctions.
French President Emmanuel Macron:
EMMANUEL MACRON, French President (through translator): A serious crisis of confidence
was opened by a reimposition of sanctions by the United States.
But Tehran continues to abide by its nuclear obligations.
We need to build together a long-term strategy in order to manage this crisis, and it cannot
boil down to just sanctions and containment.
NICK SCHIFRIN: And British Prime Minister Theresa May:
THERESA MAY, British Prime Minister: For many years, the scale and nature of Iran's nuclear
program raised serious international concerns.
The JCPOA was an important step forward in addressing these.
It remains the best means of preventing Iran developing a nuclear weapon.
NICK SCHIFRIN: Iran promises to abide by the deal's nuclear limits.
And, today, President Hassan Rouhani said the U.S. isolated itself from its allies.
HASSAN ROUHANI, Iranian President (through translator): We are not isolated, as a matter
of fact.
America is isolated.
At the General Assembly, America was isolated.
At the Security Council, America was isolated.
BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, Israeli Prime Minister: Mr. President, Donald, thank you.
NICK SCHIFRIN: On Iran, the U.S. is aligned with Israel, and the president met with Prime
Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.
But he suggested moving the U.S. Embassy to Jerusalem will require Israeli accommodations
and peace talks.
And for the first time, he declared support for creating a Palestinian state next to Israel.
DONALD TRUMP: I like two-state solution.
That's what I think works best.
I don't even have to speak to anybody.
That's my feeling.
Now, you may have a different feeling.
I don't think so.
But I think two-state solution works best.
NICK SCHIFRIN: Mr. Trump said his diplomatic approach to North Korea is also working.
In a meeting with Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe, he pulled out a letter from Kim
Jong-un and said it was a sign that Kim, who has overseen a nuclear program and vast human
rights abuses, is changing his stripes.
DONALD TRUMP: North Korea, under the leadership of ®MDNM¯Chairman Kim, has tremendous economic
potential, tremendous.
And I think that Chairman Kim sees that maybe better than anybody.
NICK SCHIFRIN: And, today, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo announced he would go to Pyongyang
next month, with the intention of setting up a second summit between President Trump
and Kim Jong-un.
And the president was asked why he would hold a second summit.
He said, well, Kim asked for it.
And he said that letter that he got, Judy, is a sign that the two sides are making progress.
JUDY WOODRUFF: So, Nick, one other thing that president made news on today is, he said that
China, China is meddling in the U.S. 2018 elections.
Tell us more about what he said.
NICK SCHIFRIN: Yes, he hasn't said this before, certainly not on this scale and at this platform
at the U.N.
And he said this in the Security Council and at a press conference just a few minutes ago.
He said that China was meddling in elections because, in his words, he was being tough
on China economically.
Now, he gave no details on that, both at -- in the Security Council and at the press conference.
And we asked a senior administration official about that.
And he gave a few details on the bone.
And we should say, these are not the kind of interference in the election that we saw
in 2016 at all, one example, China courting politicians and farmers in states that voted
for Trump.
Now, I should say, Judy, China has invested in swing states and swing districts long before
Trump became the president, in order to have some political influence.
Second example, rewarding journalists and think tanks who are nice to China.
Again, they have done that before Trump became president.
Intimidating people who are critical of China.
Again, they have done that before Trump became president.
And ,lastly, using state media for propaganda against President Trump.
Again, they did that before Trump became president.
And what President Trump did not mention today, Judy, is Russia, which, according to the intelligence
community in 2016, launched the hacking campaign into President Trump's opponent, distributed
that information, and launched a disinformation campaign as well.
And the intelligence community says that is ongoing in 2018.
President Trump did not mention that at all today.
JUDY WOODRUFF: No mention of it.
A lot to keep track of.
Nick Schifrin, covering the United Nations General Assembly for us this week, thank you,
Nick.
In the day's other news: President Trump said he does not want to fire Rod Rosenstein, the
deputy attorney general, who oversees the Russia investigation.
At his news conference this evening, the president noted that Rosenstein has denied that he talked
of recording the president or trying to remove him from office.
DONALD TRUMP, President of the United States: I would much prefer keeping Rod Rosenstein,
much prefer.
Many people say I have the right to absolutely fire him.
He said he did not say it.
He said he does not believe that.
JUDY WOODRUFF: The two men had been scheduled to meet tomorrow.
But the president said he may postpone that, so that he can focus on the Senate hearing
with Supreme Court nominee Brett Kavanaugh.
The Federal Reserve has raised a key short-term interest rate for the third time this year
to 2.25 percent.
It serves as a benchmark for many consumer and business loans.
Fed Chair Jerome Powell said the U.S. economy is strong, but he did warn against a drawn-out
trade war with China and other nations.
JEROME POWELL, Federal Reserve Chairman: I think, if this, perhaps inadvertently, goes
to a place where we have widespread tariffs that remain in place for a long time, a more
protectionist world, that's going to be bad for the United States economy.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Fed policy-makers also signaled that one more rate hike is likely this year
and three next year.
President Trump now says that he will sign a sweeping spending bill to prevent a government
shutdown come Monday.
The Senate already approved the bill totaling $854 billion.
And the House followed suit today.
It funds the military and many domestic agencies for the fiscal year that begins October 1.
It doesn't fund the president's border wall.
There are small signs of hope tonight for towns in South Carolina facing floodwaters
from Hurricane Florence.
Officials today lowered their flood predictions for Conway and Georgetown, where several rivers
converge, but acknowledge things could change again.
GOV.
HENRY MCMASTER (R), South Carolina: All three river systems were flooded, not only from
water from South Carolina, but that that came in the second wave from North Carolina.
So this is unprecedented, and we are still in full battle mode in Georgetown County,
in Horry County.
JUDY WOODRUFF: The hurricane is blamed for 47 deaths in the Carolinas and Virginia.
Pope Francis urged China's Roman Catholics today to trust him after reaching an agreement
with Beijing on naming Chinese bishops.
He acknowledged that some Chinese Catholics feel abandoned by any deal with China's communist
government.
But he said the goal is to unify the Chinese church after decades of division.
POPE FRANCIS, Leader of Catholic Church (through translator): I decided to address the Chinese
Catholics and all the universal church with a message of fraternal encouragement.
With that, I'm hoping that China can open a new phase, one that helps to heal the wounds
of the past and reestablish and maintain the full communion of all Chinese Catholics to
take up with new conviction the message of the Gospel.
JUDY WOODRUFF: China's underground Catholics have long been persecuted for refusing to
join a state-run Catholic association.
And on Wall Street, stocks sagged late in the day, after the Federal Reserve raised
rates.
The Dow Jones industrial average loss nearly 107 points to close at 26385.
The Nasdaq fell 17, and the S&P 500 slipped nine.
Still to come on the "NewsHour: a conversation with Turkey's president at the United Nations;
inside the innovative efforts to combat the world's plastics problem; and a Brief But
Spectacular take on writing about other people's lives.
Ties between the U.S. and Turkey, longtime NATO allies, are deeply strained.
The U.S. hopes to get an American pastor out of jail in Turkey.
The Turks accuse the U.S. of harboring Fethullah Gulen, an exiled cleric who Turkey blames
for a fail coup.
In addition, there are Syria, Russia and internal issues.
Amna Nawaz spoke with Turkey's President Recep Tayyip Erdogan earlier today.
But, first, she has some background.
AMNA NAWAZ: The decades-old alliance is now under increasing tension.
One flash point, the fate of American evangelical pastor Andrew Brunson, held for nearly two
years in Turkey.
He was swept up in the crackdown after the July 2016 coup attempt against Erdogan.
Vice President Pence had this ultimatum for Erdogan in late July:
MIKE PENCE, Vice President of the United States: I have a message on behalf of the president
of the United States of America.
Release Pastor Andrew Brunson now, or be prepared to face the consequences.
AMNA NAWAZ: President Trump levied sanctions on Turkey, and Ankara responded in kind.
The dispute accelerated the decline of the Turkish lira.
It's lost 40 percent of its value this year.
Yesterday, Erdogan clearly had Mr. Trump's economic policy front of mind.
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN, Turkish President (through translator): None of us can remain silent
to the arbitrary cancellation of commercial agreements, the spreading prevalence of protectionism,
and the use of economic sanctions as weapons, because the negative effects of these twisted
developments will eventually affect all of us.
AMNA NAWAZ: Erdogan became prime minister in 2003.
Then, in 2014 and again this year, he was elected president, a position he's converted
into Turkey's preeminent power center.
One major challenge to his government, the grinding war in Syria that has forced more
than three million refugees across Turkey's southern border.
Tens of thousands more were sure to follow if Syria's Assad regime, backed by Russia,
made an all-out assault on Idlib province in Northwest Syria.
It's the last major stronghold of Islamist and rebel fighters.
But Erdogan struck a deal last week with Russian President Vladimir Putin to forestall that
attack.
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): We believe that Turkey cleared the way for
peace and political solution in Syria, especially in the Idlib province.
Our goal is to clear the Syrian territory all the way from Manbij to the Iraqi border
from terrorist presence.
AMNA NAWAZ: That broad reference to terrorist presence also refers to America's Kurdish
allies in Syria, one more flash point between allies.
Ankara considers the so-called YPG and its political wing, the PYD, to be terrorists
allied to Turkish separatist Kurds.
U.S. forces are training, equipping and fighting alongside the Syrian Kurds to defeat ISIS.
I sat down with President Erdogan earlier this afternoon.
Mr. President, thank you so much for making the time to speak with us.
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: Thank you.
AMNA NAWAZ: I want to begin by asking you about Syria.
Last week, you signed an agreement with Russia, specifically with regards to Idlib, the last
rebel stronghold in Syria.
And, as part of that agreement, you pledged that all radical terrorist groups would be
removed from Idlib by October 15.
I wanted to ask you how you begin to figure out who is a radical terrorist.
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): As to who those groups are, we had already
identified those groups, together with Russia, anyways.
We already know who they are.
With our intelligence organization in Turkey, we are now working towards that.
As we speak, things are progressing well.
It is about removing heavy weapons from that region.
As we do that, the people of Idlib, living in Idlib, will again have peace.
AMNA NAWAZ: There was a time you advocated for regime change in Syria.
And it's fair to say that you have had a bit of a policy shift when it comes to Syria.
Last week, you signed this agreement with Russia.
Yesterday, in your speech at the United Nations, you hailed the alliance with Russia and working
towards efforts in Syria.
Russia is the chief backer of Bashar al-Assad.
So, is it fair to assume that you believe Bashar al-Assad has won the war in Syria?
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): If we were to create such a suspicion against
Russia, that would be a wrong thing to do.
The Assad regime has never been an interlocutor for us, because, as Turkey, we don't recognize
Assad.
As Turkey, our interlocutor is the people of Syria.
And they are our brothers and sisters.
We have to come up to a result as soon as possible.
We are now working on two things.
First is preparation of the constitution.
And second is a political process and opening up the political process to the people of
Syria, because the people of Syria expect the political process to become functional
as soon as possible.
And for that process to be functional, a constitution is needed.
AMNA NAWAZ: I would like to ask you about the relationship between America and Turkey.
This morning, you published a very strongly worded op-ed calling for a larger reform to
take place at the United Nations.
But in that piece, you named only the U.S.
You said that this administration has undermined the world order.
Do you still consider the U.S. to be an ally for Turkey?
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): We are strategic partners with the U.S. within
NATO.
For any country that is our strategic partner, it wouldn't be suitable to talk about possible
sanctions against one strategic partner.
And, so far, Turkey has always fulfilled its duties of being the strategic partner.
And we will continue to do so.
We're together with them under NATO.
We act with them under NATO.
And Turkey has always been the country that has defended the outpost of NATO.
And, interestingly, imagine you intervening in Raqqa, and, while doing that, imagine you
don't work with your strategic partner, but with a terrorist organization instead.
Who are those terrorist organizations?
The PYD and YPG, who happen to be the extensions of the PKK terrorist organizations.
This is what we told the U.S.
We said, you're not doing the right thing.
Now, seeing our strategic partner working hand in hand with those terrorist organizations
is something we could not accept, we had a hard time accepting.
And now, as far as the U.S. is concerned, do you know how much weapons the U.S. sent
to the north of Syria?
More than 18,000 big truckloads of ammunition and weapons were sent.
Who will those weapons be used against?
Because those are places which are closest to our border.
And there was this terrorists corridor there, and we took it apart.
Now, think of our strategic partner engaging in such acts.
That is sad for us to see.
It's wrong.
AMNA NAWAZ: I would like to move on to another issue that's come up between the U.S. and
Turkey.
And that is the issue of Pastor Brunson, Andrew Brunson, who's been detained in Turkey since
2016 now.
The U.S. has asked that he be released.
He's been charged with terrorism and espionage.
But, recently, Pastor Brunson was moved to house arrest.
There was a new prosecutor appointed in the case as well.
And he has a hearing coming up in October.
The U.S. has signaled they would like him released by then.
Would you intervene to release Pastor Brunson, an American citizen, back to the U.S.?
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): Now, in international law, using political
pressure to free those people who are convicted or detained, would that be possible under
international law?
As a journalist, have you ever seen this?
You could have that only in totalitarian or authoritarian regimes.
You wouldn't have it in a country like Turkey, where there is the rule of law.
Now, as we speak, there Fethullah Gulen in the U.S.
And he has been in this country since 1999.
And he was head of an organization which attempted a coup in our country; 251 of our citizens
became martyrs, and 2,193 of our people were injured.
And he lives in Pennsylvania on 400 acres.
Now, we asked for him.
We asked for extradition.
And we signed all the necessary documents and paperwork.
They could have deported him with an administrative decision.
But, unfortunately, the U.S. didn't extradite him.
AMNA NAWAZ: Are you saying that, if the U.S. agrees to extradite Gulen back to Turkey,
that you would then release the Americans who are in custody in Turkey right now?
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): Now, I told you I'm not talking about any
reciprocity.
I'm talking about law, rather.
Fethullah Gulen is not part of a judicial process right now.
It's just that he's living like a sultan on 400 acres.
Brunson, though, is an entirely different situation.
He is being tried in court as we speak.
And we sent all necessary documents about Fethullah Gulen to the necessary authorities.
AMNA NAWAZ: Amnesty International estimates Pastor Brunson is one of 15 to 20 American
citizens currently in Turkish custody.
Is that correct?
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): The number cannot be that high.
AMNA NAWAZ: Do you know how many American citizens are currently in Turkish custody?
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): Currently, as far as I know, six or seven
Americans either are in custody or are detained.
AMNA NAWAZ: You yourself have come under heavy criticism from some human rights groups, particularly
after, as you mentioned, that failed coup attempt in 2016.
I have to put these numbers to you because they're striking.
It's estimated 100,000 people were dismissed from public sector jobs, more than 50,000
arrested and imprisoned.
Your critics have called it a purge of your political opposition.
Are you purging your political opposition?
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): Now, one cannot accept such information, of
course, because you talk based on the information you get from different press and media.
Currently, there are people behind bars.
It's true.
Numerically, yes, there are high numbers of people behind bars.
There are 32,000 detained people who have been arrested.
It's not hundreds of thousands.
Those trials must and I hope will be completed by the end of this year.
AMNA NAWAZ: Setting aside your political opposition, specifically, when it comes to journalists
in Turkey, Turkey has been called the biggest jailer of journalists.
Back in December, you held 73 journalists in your...
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): How many?
Can you give me the figure?
AMNA NAWAZ: In December, the figure was 73 journalists who were held in prisons, which
was more than any other country.
That was according to the Committee to Protect Journalists.
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN (through translator): All of these things you have said are wrong.
And the sources are not right.
Those are lies.
The number of people who are behind bars and who are journalists, real journalists, may
be 20 or 30.
Some of these people have committed terrorism crimes, but they have badges of journalists.
We're not talking about actual and genuine journalists here.
AMNA NAWAZ: President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, thank you very much for your time and speaking
with us.
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: Thank you.
Thank you.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Now to our series on the plastics problem around the world.
As we said last night, one of the biggest problems is actually how to recycle the material
in the U.S.
In this country, the rate of recycling plastics is just 9 percent.
That compares to 30 percent in Europe.
Amna is back with a report that took her to three states, exploring innovative ideas aimed
at reducing plastic waste.
It's part of our Breakthroughs reporting on invention and innovation for our series the
Leading Edge of science.
AMNA NAWAZ: For over 40 years, this is one of the ways we have tried to tackle our growing
plastic problem, sorting, weeding out, and sorting some more, like in this Seattle facility.
Every day, an estimated 750 tons of material go through this process.
And every step along the way, just like this one, is designed to remove one more material.
For an ultra-durable material like plastic, the goal of this system was to get us to use
less by reusing what we'd already made.
Today, new innovative ways of recirculating our plastic are being road-tested, literally
in this case.
This is the very first plastic road in the U.S., on the University of California-San
Diego's campus.
Toby McCartney is behind MacRebur a British start-up that mixes recycled plastic pellets
into asphalt to make longer-lasting and cheaper roads.
TOBY MCCARTNEY, Managing Director, MacRebur: The downside to waste plastics is, it lasts
for so long.
A bottle will last for maybe 500 years.
What we're using is the ability of those plastics, because they last so long, but in our roads.
We want our roads to last so long before they need any maintenance.
AMNA NAWAZ: But are reusing and recycling really making a difference?
ROLAND GEYER, University of California, Santa Barbara: I would say that the way we recycle
plastic at the moment is not part of the solution.
I would even go as far as saying it's part of the problem.
AMNA NAWAZ: Roland Geyer is an industrial ecologist at the University of California,
Santa Barbara.
He says that in the 70 years plastic has been around, we have created nine billion tons
of it, most of which still exists.
ROLAND GEYER: The only plastic that does not need to be disposed of is plastic that was
never made.
So even recycled material, you can't cycle it forever.
BECCA FONG, Seattle Public Utilities: Not all plastics are created equal.
AMNA NAWAZ: Becca Fong of Seattle Public Utilities walked us through the city's impressive and
growing recycling effort.
Still, she says, the process isn't perfect.
BECCA FONG: It's geared to capture certain types of plastics of certain sizes.
And if it doesn't fit into those categories, it's not really recoverable.
AMNA NAWAZ: So, speaking of certain sizes, something like this, a tiny little plastic
straw, where does something like that straw fit?
BECCA FONG: The fact that it made it here is pretty impressive.
But the vast majority of small items are going to fall through the machinery and not be able
to be recovered to be recycled.
AMNA NAWAZ: So, Seattle started small and in July became the first major city in the
U.S. to ban all plastic straws.
It is that piece of material that is so small and so nuanced and actually kind of an extra
for a lot of people, that it actually makes people stop and think, do I really need to
have this straw?
And that's probably the bigger impact.
MAMI HARA, Director, Seattle Public Utilities: A straw that I use today in Seattle can end
up in the Pacific Ocean and last there for thousands of years, or it can return back
to your plate in 10 years as microplastics embedded in some fish.
AMNA NAWAZ: Mami Hara heads up Seattle Public Utilities.
Before her team could implement and enforce the straw ban, which also includes plastic
utensils, they had to get local businesses on board.
MAMI HARA: For a lot of businesses, it hasn't been a hard sell.
For those who are concerned about the price point, we try to work with them to find viable
alternatives that don't impact their purse too much.
BOB DONEGAN, President, Ivar's: We will buy about a million straws this year, and the
cost of straws has tripled.
AMNA NAWAZ: Bob Donegan is the president of Ivar's, an 80-year-old Seattle seafood institution.
BOB DONEGAN: We don't routinely put a straw in a drink.
We ask everybody, would you like a straw?
And they can always have one.
And these are the new compostable straws.
They are made from plants.
AMNA NAWAZ: But the compostable straws don't work for him in other ways.
BOB DONEGAN: So I challenge you to suck a milkshake through that straw and see if you
can make it.
AMNA NAWAZ: That's not easy.
BOB DONEGAN: It's pretty hard.
AMNA NAWAZ: So he spent more money and ordered bigger straws.
Since the ban, costs have gone up.
But Donegan says he budgeted around them by buying goods early and in bulk.
So there's no use, he says, in complaining.
BOB DONEGAN: Put on your big boy pants and get used to it.
Everything the government does isn't fair.
But our customers expect it of us, and we want to do what our customers want.
WES BENSON, Taco Time Northwest: Not only are we saying that the environment is important
to us.
This is a way for us to put our money where our mouth is.
AMNA NAWAZ: Wes Benson at Taco Time, another area food chain, says they took Seattle's
straw and utensil ban one step further.
Today, every single item they give customers, from utensils and cups to plates and bowls,
is fully compostable, meaning they're made of natural materials and can be turned into
compost after being tossed.
WES BENSON: One of the nice things about being 100 percent compostable is, you can make it
a part of your story.
And we're a local company.
The environment is important to us.
And we're willing to pay five times as much for our packaging.
AMNA NAWAZ: Seattle's efforts to cut back on plastic extends beyond restaurants.
Behind the scenes at Safeco Field, we get a look at the stacks of compostable items
they now require food vendors to use.
Last year, the park managed to recycle or compost 96 percent of all waste.
Trevor Gooby runs operations at the ballpark.
TREVOR GOOBY, Safeco Field: It definitely is more work to sort through the trash that
we have after the game and to do these type of things.
But, again, we feel it's really important for our business.
And it's important because our fans are asking us to do it.
AMNA NAWAZ: All those compostable items end up in piles like these, at facilities like
this, run by Jason Lenz and his family outside of Seattle.
For what you guys do, how much of a problem do plastics present?
JASON LENZ, Lenz Enterprises: I would say it's a you know it's not insurmountable.
At the same time, it's -- it's definitely a problem.
AMNA NAWAZ: Even hear, bits of plastic need to be sorted out.
Lenz has been in this business since 2008, after expanding his sand and gravel company.
So, without the city asking this of you or showing that there was a demand for this,
you guys likely wouldn't be doing this?
JASON LENZ: That's correct.
Seattle is a big pusher of organics diversion for compost, yes, so that's why we're in this
business.
AMNA NAWAZ: Lenz's company now turns out hundreds of thousands of tons of compost a year and
sells it to everyone from soil companies, to local governments, to home gardeners.
What is in here?
MORGAN VAGUE, Reed College Graduate: So these are bags of dirt that I collected from various
sites around the Houston area.
AMNA NAWAZ: Reed College student Morgan Vague had a hunch: If plastic really is everywhere,
maybe, in heavily polluted areas, bacteria have evolved to eat it.
And maybe those bacteria could take a bite out of our plastic problem.
So she collected samples from some of the dirtiest places around her hometown of Houston,
Texas, like sites of past oil spills and sites deemed contaminated by the EPA, and brought
them back to the lab.
So, you identify the bacteria you want to take a closer look at.
And then you put them in these test tubes.
MORGAN VAGUE: Yes.
AMNA NAWAZ: And the only food you give them, basically, is these plastics.
MORGAN VAGUE: Yes, exactly.
And we're fortunate to find some that did a pretty good job.
AMNA NAWAZ: But Vague found that the bacteria works much too slowly to be useful just yet.
MORGAN VAGUE: What a lot of our research is focused on is sort of like, how can we speed
up this process a bit?
How can we kind of scale this up and get it to an applicable kind of stage?
Because, you know, right now, it's just bugs in a tube.
AMNA NAWAZ: Vague says yes, it's just one study in very early stages, but she's excited
for where it could lead.
MORGAN VAGUE: All little girls want to change the world when they grow up, right?
I think we need more of these kind of grassroots efforts and kind of thinking outside the box,
or outside the plastic bottle, and kind of saying what sort of solutions we can find.
AMNA NAWAZ: Without meaningful solutions, experts warn, our trajectory means more and
more plastic on our land and in our water.
According to one study, if current production trends continue, by the year 2050, there will
be more plastic than fish in our oceans.
Geyer says one way to fix it, get rid of all single-use packaging, things like bag, straws
and bottles, that make up 40 percent of our plastic.
ROLAND GEYER: That would make a huge difference.
That will be -- and I think it's really doable.
Lots of people are at a point where they don't like what they see, that there's real willingness
to change behavior, to do things differently.
And I think there are many, many ways we can do it, then still allow us to have the good
life.
AMNA NAWAZ: To do that, experts say it will take governments, companies and individuals
working together, each taking small steps to bring about big change.
For the "PBS NewsHour" in Santa Barbara, California, I'm Amna Nawaz.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And, tomorrow, we will take a look at why China is no longer accepting
much of our recycling, including plastics, and the impact that's having.
The president held a press conference this evening in New York that lasted nearly 90
minutes.
We played some excerpts from that at the top of the program.
But we want to take a moment now to listen to one more question and answer.
Our White House correspondent, Yamiche Alcindor, was there, and asked Mr. Trump about the initial
reaction when he addressed the U.N. General Assembly yesterday.
YAMICHE ALCINDOR: Yesterday, you were talking about your administration's accomplishments
at the United Nations, and a lot of the leaders laughed.
Why do you think they were laughing?
DONALD TRUMP, President of the United States: Well, that's fake news.
YAMICHE ALCINDOR: And what was that experience like?
DONALD TRUMP: Yes, it's fake news.
And it was covered that way.
OK.
So I said that, since my election, our economy has become the hottest in the world, tax reductions,
regulations.
Confidence levels are the highest in 18 years, really soon to be historic.
Unemployment is the lowest in the history of our country.
As I said, our country is now stronger than ever before.
It's true.
I mean, it is true.
And I heard a little rustle.
And I said, it's true.
And I heard smiles.
And I said, oh, I didn't know there would be that kind of -- they weren't laughing at
me.
They were laughing with me.
We had fun.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And Yamiche joins me now by telephone.
She's still in New York.
Yamiche, the president wanted to set the record straight on that.
Much of that news conference, though, was about Brett Kavanaugh, the Supreme Court nominee,
tomorrow's hearings, the accusations against Judge Kavanaugh.
We heard the president, Yamiche, say that he really wants to hear the woman Christine
Blasey Ford testify.
YAMICHE ALCINDOR: He did say that.
And he said that he reserved the right to pull his nomination and to withdraw the nomination
of Brett Kavanaugh if he hears something tomorrow that moves him.
And this president, of course, is someone who goes with his gut, who is very impulsive
at times.
So, there is an -- there is an opportunity there for the president to possibly say that
he does not want Brett Kavanaugh to be his nominee.
But the president said, in this country, you are guilty until proven innocent.
And he said that because he said: I myself face false allegations from women who say
that I acted sexually inappropriate.
And, of course, there are a number of women who have said that about the president.
And he's saying that he feels for Brett Kavanaugh, because of that, a sense of kinship.
So that is somewhat coloring his view of tomorrow's hearing.
JUDY WOODRUFF: It was interesting, Yamiche, because, early on in the news conference,
I heard him say that these accusations, not only from Christine Blasey Ford, but these
two other women who've come forward in the last day or two, he said, these are all false
accusations.
But then he also said, we should hear from these women.
So, there's a bit of a contradiction going here.
YAMICHE ALCINDOR: There is definitely a contradiction there.
The president is saying that he wants to remain open, but he's also saying that these women
are not essentially telling the truth.
He was asked over and over again, are these women lying?
And while he wouldn't say that, yes, Professor Ford is lying, yes, all these other women,
Deborah Ramirez, is lying, he said that this is all about a -- this is all part of a con,
and that Democrats are -- waited until the last minute to do this.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Yamiche, it was quite a tour de force, 90 minutes.
Yamiche Alcindor, reporting for us from New York, thank you.
YAMICHE ALCINDOR: Thanks, Judy.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And that is the "NewsHour" for tonight.
I'm Judy Woodruff.
Don't forget to join us tomorrow at 10:00 a.m.
Eastern on your local PBS stations and streaming online for the Senate hearing with Brett Kavanaugh
and his accuser, Christine Blasey Ford.
And, of course, we will be back right here tomorrow night.
For all of us at the "PBS NewsHour," thank you, and we'll see you soon.
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